How to get author-short title in subsequent citations?

MirandaKaufmann
Hello,

Apologies if this has been covered before. I'm new to Zotero.

I'm currently using the Modern Language Review style. But it only cites the author in subsequent footnotes. I want it to cite author, short title. Is it possible to change this easily?

If not, I am open to suggestions for other styles that do this automatically.

Ideally, I want my citations to read as:

First citation: C.M. Cipolla, Before the Industrial Revolution: European Society and Economy, 1100–1700, trans. F. Franks (London: Methuen, 1976), p. 60.

Then: Cipolla, Before the Industrial Revolution, p. 62.

Is there also a style that does just author-short title throughout?

Thanks!
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  • adamsmith
    Is using Chicago Manual of Style an option? That does what you want. The full note version uses full citation on first mention and then author, shortitle, the note version uses author short-title throughout.
  • MirandaKaufmann
    Thanks Adam. How do you switch between full note and note versions?
  • adamsmith
    They are different styles, so just like you'd switch between any other two citation styles.
  • MirandaKaufmann
    Ok great. I've switched to Chicago Manual of Style note version. But it's rendering page references as just e.g. '300' not 'p. 300'. Is it possible to change that?

    Thanks so much for all your help with this!
  • adamsmith
    Not without editing the style which is always a bit more involved. Can I ask what this is for? I would generally encourage the use of standardized styles without modification.
  • MirandaKaufmann
    It's for a history book I'm writing, and I'm trying to follow my publisher's style guide. Is there a different style that includes 'p.'?

    I suppose I could always type in p. as I add page references as I go along?
  • adamsmith
    I wouldn't recommend adding the p., that'll cause other issue potentially. Which publisher is that from if you don't mind? Are the guidelines public or easy to share?
  • MirandaKaufmann
    Oneworld Publications. I just have their guidelines as a Word Doc, but can email it to you if you give me your address- or can think of another way to share?

    Or, I might just write to them and ask if they really care about the 'p.'!
  • DoulosI
    edited May 3, 2019
    Is there any way to change this manually also? Ideally like this:

    Footnote 1:
    Kittel et. al., 1964 (TDNT) 2:221 (δικαίωμα:B1)
    (That is: author et al, year (short title, italics). Page number.)

    Subsequent footnotes:
    TDNT 2:221 (δικαίωμα:B1)
    (That is: Short title: Page number.)

    Optionally: Author, short title, page.


    As for now, as you can see below, Zotero doesn´t even include the short title in the bibliography:

    Kittel, Gerhard, Gerhard Friedrich, og Geoffrey W. Bromiley, red. 1964. Theological Dictionary of the New Testament. Logos Edition. Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans.
  • adamsmith
    Not quite sure what you're asking -- you seem to be requesting a completely new style?
  • DoulosI
    edited May 3, 2019
    Maybe I do. I don’t know. I’m asking how to modify an existing style to suit my needs. There are no styles in Zotero today completely identical to my school’s manual of style.

    The style I’m using is a modification of Chicago. All footnotes (first and subsequent) are “author yyyy:page number”. I would like to change the style manually to let first footnote include whole title (author, full title, yyyy:page), and let subsequent footnotes have “author, short title, page number” only. My school’s manual of style allows me to, but I don’t know how to manually modify the style I’m currently using.
  • BekahLegg
    I have to use Chicago for my dissertation, but need to show the short title in subsequent references - it only does that if it comes after a different reference - if it's the same in a row, it just does author date - is there a way round this? I can't manage the visual editor at all - it's beyond me! It would be great if there was a preference option for this.

    This is great -
    Victor H. Matthews, Judges and Ruth, New Cambridge Bible Commentary (Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 2004), 4.
    Block, Judges, Ruth, 6:147.
    Butler, Judges, 8:lvii.

    This is not -
    Butler, Judges, 8:xvi.
    Butler, 8:lxvi.
    Block, Judges, Ruth, 6:52.
    Lilley, ‘A Literary Appreciation of the Book of Judges’, 102.

    Where butler in the second section loses his title but somehow keeps his volume number
  • bwiernik
    @adamsmith This request comes up really frequently. Could we add a version of Chicago that always shows the short title in subsequent citations, instead of following the new "ibid-like" rules?
  • maier.de
    @bwiernik @adamsmith
    This would be absolutely helpful. That should be it: https://gist.github.com/denismaier/86f4d44203e34223f40af33635cd14ff
  • adamsmith
    @maier.de @bwiernik -- yes, I think I've actually said elsewhere that I'd take this as a PR or do it myself, though the hardest part about this may actually be the naming to not confuse the various options.
  • bwiernik
    chicago-fullnote-short-title-subsequent?
  • adamsmith
    @Rintze how does that sound to you?
  • maier.de
    "chicago-fullnote-short-title-subsequent": possible.

    Or, for note styles we could perhaps use a naming scheme that indicates how citations are rendered depending on their position: styleguide-note-first-subsequent-ibid

    - Chicago fullnote style without the new ibid rule:
    chicago-note-full-short-short

    - Chicago note style that always uses short form:
    chicago-note-short-short-short

    - Chicago note style with ibid:
    chicago-note-short-short-ibid

    - Chicago note style with the new ibid rule
    chicago-note-short-short-authoronly(?)
  • adamsmith
    The requested style is now available. Sorry it took so long:
    https://www.zotero.org/styles?q=id:chicago-fullnote-bibliography-short-title-subsequent
  • meerutwala
    @adamsmith Thank you.
    Is there a style for CMOS 16th edition which does this? I mean, it creates subsequent footnotes with Author last name, Short title, page number without the letter 'p'?
    I can't seem to find in CMOS style list, one that says WITHOUT Ibid. Thanks.
  • adamsmith
    duplicate of https://forums.zotero.org/discussion/81172/cant-find-cmos-16th-edition-style-note-without-ibid#latest (and of Twitter). As bwiernik says elsewhere, please be respectful of people's time and ask your question once.
  • meerutwala
    @adamsmith Ok. I will.
    Is there a solution to this problem?
  • meerutwala
    https://www.zotero.org/styles?q=id:chicago-fullnote-bibliography-short-title-subsequent
    Tried this style, it's for CMOS (full note). Looking for a similar one for CMOS (note) that renders subsequent footnotes with last name, short title, and page number instead of ibid and without altogether getting rid of the title.
    Examples:
    1. Morrison, Beloved, 3.
    2. Morrison, Beloved, 18.
    3. Morrison, Beloved, 18.
    Thanks.
  • adamsmith
    Got it, so the note part is the issue.
    https://raw.githubusercontent.com/citation-style-language/styles/4e761dcd233d5be8ba6594543bdcd6ce430e2222/chicago-note-biblio-no-ibid.csl should do what you want (right-click --> save link as on this link and then just double-click on the file to install)
    I believe this is likely to get overwritten periodically if you install this exact version, so you'd have to open in a text editor and change the style id as described here:
    https://www.zotero.org/support/dev/citation_styles/style_editing_step-by-step

  • meerutwala
    @adamsmith Thank you. Your solutions are always excellent!
    However, one issue still remains. In the subsequent footnotes, the rendering is now getting rid of the title altogether instead of shortening it. E.g.:

    1. Morrison, Beloved, 3.
    2. Morrison,18.
    3. Morrison,18.

    I hope this 'new' style could be tweaked to deliver with the short title. Unfortunately, I don't know anything about visual editor or tweaking. Thank you once again.
  • adamsmith
    The style above should show up as Chicago Manual of Style 16th edition (note, no Ibid.) and always prints short titles.
    If it doesn't, it has likely auto-updated, see my note and link about the style id, which really is simple to do.
  • meerutwala
    Ok. Should I edit the style Id before installing the downloaded xml file or after installing it into Zotero desktop? If it has to be done, before installing, how do I edit the style title id? Thanks.
  • meerutwala
    edited February 1, 2020
    I think I was able to install if after modifying the style id and it does render subsequent footnotes with short titles. I hope it stays the same... Thank you.
  • simon.bakbo
    How do I use short title with the chicago 17th-style note with ibid?

    When I insert a note, it always takes the short title. But I want the title as the first note and then afterwards, when I have inserted another note, the short title, but now it goes like:
    Hjorth Pedersen, Respekt!, 12.
    Lippert-Rasmussen, Politisk teori og filosofi, 45.
    Hjorth Pedersen, Respekt!, 14.
    Lippert-Rasmussen, Politisk teori og filosofi, 47.
  • adamsmith
    If you want full title on first citation, you want the full note, not the note, Chicago style.
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