Reformat an endnote generated bibliography

IvanB
Hello,
I'm leaving windows to start using ubuntu. So I moved from Endnote+OpenOffice to Zotero+LibreOffice.
Now, all my litterature is sorted in an openoffice file in different chapters (a huge file that took me ages to make). All my references were made using EndNote. Now I need to continue formatting this file but with Zotero. I need to be able to continue updating what I have done before.
How can I do that ? How can I make Zotero understand what Endnote has written in my file ?
In endnote, if I click on "unformat citations", the reference numbers become something like {author , bignumber}. I think I can change it automatically with endnote to be anything i want. But I would like Zotero to understand it. Is there an easy way to do this ? Or perhaps, is there an equivalent of "unformat citations" in Zotero, so that I can see what format Zotero likes ? And in Zotero's database, do all the reference have a given number like in Endnote ?

thanks
  • adamsmith
    Sorry, there's absolutely no way to do this. In fact, to the best of my knowledge, there currently are no two reference managers that would work together like this, though Zotero and Mendeley are moving in that direction.
    If you want to switch to Zotero for this project you will have to manually re-insert all citations.
  • IvanB
    As far as I remember, in Refworks, to insert a citation you can write {{235}} for example, where 234 is the number of the ref in the database. In endnote, the references are also numbered in the database and it is possible to customize the information replacing the citations in the text, when formatting it. In principle, it would be possible to make endnote write only that reference number and thereby make something that would be understandable by Refworks with little modifications. I was hoping that something like that was possible with Zotero, but it is a pity that such a thing is not possible. It seems that it should be very easy thing to implement in a software.
  • mark
    Now, all my litterature is sorted in an openoffice file in different chapters (a huge file that took me ages to make).
    What does this mean? Is the openoffice file a way for organizing the references in your library? Zotero offers many possibilities (Collections, Tags) for organizing references, so if you used that file for such a purpose you might be able to replace that workflow with Zotero. I know you're not asking for that, it's just a thought.
    It seems that it should be very easy thing to implement in a software.
    Unfortunately, this is not actually the case. What makes it difficult is the fact that programs like EndNote and Refworks are run by for-profit companies. It is not in their interest to make their programs all too interoperable with other software.
  • adamsmith
    There are even more issues.
    The biggest issue is that even if Zotero included such a system based on a numerical labels (which actually might happen in the future in some form or the other), you would still have to translate endnote reference numbers back to Zotero reference numbers - but Zotero reference numbers, because they're designed to allow for collaboration among other things, are purposefully not just numbers like #123. Since that means you'd have to replace each reference number by the corresponding Zotero reference code you'd be back to square 1.

    What will be more helpful for this in the future are advances in RTF scan - right now, Zotero's RTF scan just formats the document, isn't super reliable, and doesn't recognize a lot of formatting. But once it is improved to recognize more mark-up and to insert Zotero fields rather than just format, it could be used to convert formatted documents to Zotero with relative ease.
  • bdarcus
    Zotero offers many possibilities (Collections, Tags) for organizing references, so if you used that file for such a purpose you might be able to replace that workflow with Zotero.
    This. It's extremely inefficient to maintain notes for a library in a file; use Zotero notes, tags, and collections.
  • IvanB
    I'm not sure I understand everything. Sorry, I'm not only a noob, my english is also not perfect.
    I meant that it would be nice to make zotero insert a text, with, not necessarily a number like in refworks but maybe something like {1st author, Journal, volume, page} that would be just text without formatting and links. Then with a "format citations" tool, zotero could format all the text between {} and put the links and everything. It would just search the ref that corresponds to the given info and whenever 2 different refs match, it would open a window asking you to choose the right one. This is something that I thought would be easy to implement. And, if I am correct, it is possible to make Endnote read something like this. It would have many other advantages : possibility to copy and paste a ref in the same document when it is unformatted, possibility to save it with any file extension to give it to another collegue for revision for example, the possibility to format all the refs only when the document is finished (and not refresh all the references everytime you insert a new one (which can take time if you have a big document)). Most people need the refs to be formatted only when the document is finished. Refworks and Endnote can work like that and I think it makes things very easy.
    If this is what you meant, Adamsmith, yes, this would be really nice.

    About my way of organizing my bibliography, I like it. I am not a well organized person and I have a very bad memory. Having everything in front of me when I insert something helps me a lot. When I write something new I can put it at a place where it makes sense, and later I can find it better than by relying on a "search engine" and spending time to find the right terms to enter. When I insert something I can find other related things that I would probably not remember or I would not think about searching them. As I said I have a bad memory (did I say it already ?) and there are many articles that I read that I don't remember, and I use this file not only to find the references, but to learn again what I have entered a long time ago. So I need it to be organized a bit like a review or a lecture so that I don't have to search for things which I don't even remember they exist, or I don't have to worry about if I entered the right tags to be able to find it later. So I prefer to search for knowledge, a clear sentence with a meaning, and see the related articles rather than search for an article and see the related information. Also when I don't have time to write detailed notes, I can highlight a part of the text to remember that I have to go back there to finish it. It works very well and I am satisfied with this. Perhaps there are many features of Zotero that I don't know yet
  • adamsmith
    For your first point this exists, as I mention above:
    http://www.zotero.org/support/rtf_scan
    it's just not very good yet.

    For the second point - you can organize your literature the way you want. - most people find that having it in Zotero, where you can sort it by topic, by author, by publication type, by the date you entered it etc. is a much better way to keep yourself from forgetting something, but that's entirely up to you.
  • IvanB
    Ok, this is really great. Thanks a lot !
  • bdarcus
    About my way of organizing my bibliography, I like it. I am not a well organized person and I have a very bad memory. Having everything in front of me when I insert something helps me a lot. When I write something new I can put it at a place where it makes sense, and later I can find it better than by relying on a "search engine" and spending time to find the right terms to enter.
    Right; that's exactly what Zotero collections (and/or tags) are for: add your item to one-or-more collections (which look like folders), and click on them when you need them. You can even set up "smart collections" that will run searches for you.
  • mark
    edited August 23, 2011
    If I may advise you, the time it would take to get your "library document" working again would be better spent learning to work with Zotero collections, notes and tags. It's a match made in heaven for "not so well organized persons with bad memory".

    Your document was a sensible way for working with EndNote, but Zotero is much more intuitive than EndNote on many counts. Check out the quick start guide to learn more about how to organise your library. Or see my story about moving from EndNote to Zotero. Of course whatever you do is entirely up to you.
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