override IBID. in Turabian

rach625

I'm using Turabian 8th edition (full note) style manager. Is there a way to override the use "Ibid." and use "shortened footnote" even for consecutive footnotes using the same source?

adamsmith

For all footnotes or for specific ones?
For all footnotes, that'd be possible by editing the style, but not without doing that (though you could just use Chicago Manual, which is a better style anyway, and has a no ibid version available).

For individual footnotes, no, there isn't.

rach625

for all footnotes.
My institution follows the Turabian so I have to use that. Also, we are asked not to use "ibid." when it is the first or only note on the page. It's too time-consuming to try to change all the "ibids" manually, so I thought converting all the subsequent footnotes into shortened footnotes without using "ibid." will solve the problem

rach625

How do I edit the Turabian style and override the "ibid."?

rach625

@adamsmith: Can you please teach me how to edit the Turabian style so I can use the "author-shortened title-date" format in lieu of "ibid." for subsequent references?

adamsmith

Delete
<if position="ibid-with-locator">
<group delimiter=", ">
<text term="ibid"/>
<text macro="point-locators-subsequent"/>
</group>
</if>
<else-if position="ibid">
<text term="ibid"/>
</else-if>

Then turn the <else-if> right below to <if>

and 7 lines down the </else-if> to </if>

General instructions here: https://www.zotero.org/support/dev/citation_styles/style_editing_step-by-step

rach625

Gee, you're the best, @adamsmith!

rach625

Okay, so it works on a new document, but how do I get it work on an existing document I am working on?

adamsmith

Note that you should turn this into a style with a different name (and id). If you have that, you'll just be able to switch to that style under "Set Document Preferences" in the Zotero add-on for your word processor.

rach625

I think I found it by "removing the codes" (the last button on the add-in bar)

adamsmith

nonono --- dont' do that!

adamsmith

make absolutely sure you're not saving the document after you did that. You'll have to redo all citations.

rach625

Yes, I have changed the style and ID name. I also duplicated my existing document while I'm trying this modified style ... so no worries ;)

rach625

are you referring to the second to the last button on the add-in bar that says "Zotero Bibliographic Management: Zotero Set Doc Prefs"?

adamsmith

Yes, that one. It'll allow you to select a different citation style.

rach625

yes, I tried it but then Word starts hanging when I try to add a new footnote. What seems to be the problem?

adamsmith

Does it switch the citation style, though? And how long have you let Word run when it seems to hang?

rach625

yes, I was able to switch to my modified style under the "set doc prefs"

adamsmith

And the changes show? You're getting ibid? And then how about the other question -- how long did you let Word hang?

rach625

I did two things just now. I restarted my laptop and also select the entire document before switching the style under "set doc prefs"

rach625

Word hanged for several minutes before I force quit

rach625

I think it's because i have a long document with numerous footnotes so it takes time to let Zotero update the style from "ibid." to the shortened footnote style

adamsmith

Yes, that's why I'm asking. Give it a bit of time the first time.

rach625

yes, you're right ... I should give it more time ... I can now see that the footnotes are slowly being switched to the modified style one footnote at a time

rach625

Finally, the entire document is now switched to the modified style. Thanks so much, @adamsmith!