Group Libraries and PDF/Zotfile use

hfergus

Dear All,
I am a novice but happily created a workflow using zotero/zotpad/zotfile. I have now created a group library and added my research assistant so that he can input bibliography. My question relates to PDFs. Will sources that he adds that contain PDFs also be sent to my zotfile?

adamsmith

The answer is probably no--since linked files aren't supported in groups, Zotfiles move file feature isn't enabled for such groups--but it would help if you could clarify what exactly you want or expect to happen.

aurimas

and what you "workflow using zotero/zotpad/zotfile" currently is

hfergus

Let's see if I can channel the appropriate language here. I have created the settings necessary so that when I add a reference to my zotero library that has a PDF, zotfile also sends it to dropbox where I can then access and annotate it on my ipad and then send it back. So, a group library can't include PDFS at all? That doesn't make sense to me, as I have worked back through the forums and noted users who have ensured that the settings in their zotero preferences will allow for attachments in private/closed groups.

aurimas

zotfile also sends it to dropbox

This is done by taking the attachment from your Zotero data directory, copying it to Dropbox, removing the original attachment from Zotero, and attaching to the Zotero item a _link_ to the file in Dropbox.

For technical reasons (which are no longer valid), it did not make sense to sync file links in groups, because they would break on other people's computers. Thus, syncing file links in groups is not currently supported. Implementing this is relatively high on the agenda, but in won't happen very soon. So in the mean time, using Zotfile in the way you describe is not supported in groups.

You can certainly sync file attachments, but they have to remain in your Zotero data directory (as attached files, not linked), which also means you have to use Zotero web storage.

adamsmith

Since I already had typed this when aurimas responded, maybe this will be helpful to clarify that distrinction further:

Zotero distinguishes between attachments and links. An attachment is a file in the storage folder in Zotero's data directory:
https://www.zotero.org/support/zotero_data
That's the default behavior of files you import into Zotero without ZotFile.
A linked file is a file that is anywhere on your harddisk and linked to from Zotero.
The former can be used in groups, the latter currently cannot.

hfergus

I do use Zotero web storage.

So this means that anything my assistant adds I will not be able to read and annotate on my ipad? Or perhaps I would just then need to take an extra step to create a link myself after copying from the group library into my personal library?

My apologies if any of this is incoherent (most likely all of it is:))

hfergus

and thank you both for your speedy replies. i always tend to make things work, though also always in a round about way and this often leaves me feeling like I am missing something really important.

aurimas

You can use Papership App or Zotpad to access PDFs stored on zotero.org. They don't have to be stored on your DropBox.

adamsmith

I'm not 100% how ZotPad handles a situation in which groups and personal library use different file sync methods, but generally speaking you can access items on the Zotero web server with ZotPad and then send them to goodreader (or the like) to annotate (and sync them back to the server, so the annotations also appear on other devices).

Or perhaps I would just then need to take an extra step to create a link myself after copying from the group library into my personal library?

that would work, too. I don't believe ZotFile's file moving is triggered when you drag an item to your library from the group, but you can manually trigger it by right click --> Manage attachments --> Rename attachment on the item(s) you dragged over from your group.

hfergus

Ah yes, I see. So use zotpad (which is basically the app I use for all of my note-taking right now in any case, and I love it).

I guess my question (related to my attempt to delegate to my research assistant the annoyance of ensuring the pdf is attached to the citation) was simply to ensure that would still happen. And it seem like it will, as the group library interface enables "attachments" even though it does not enable "links", correct?

adamsmith

that's correct, but still, try this out before you rely on it too much.
On the Zotero side of things this is all straightforward, but you'll want to make sure that the different components of your set up play nice together.

aurimas

Correct. Basically, just use Zotero as is (without ZotFile) and let ZotPad/PaperShip deliver the PDFs to your iPad. You do need to make sure that file attachments and write permissions are enabled in your Zotero group library. You can do this under https://www.zotero.org/groups/ by following the "Manage Library" link.

hfergus

okay, i really appreciate your advice (and caution). i have spent so much time sifting through "workflow" options and finally got into a good method with zotero (to which i am absolutely dedicated after endnote and sente debacles). i really think the group library option is lovely. i can set up folders for my assistant's weekly work and then sift through these myself as I have time. but you are right, i will start him off with a trial run and see what happens.

you both are brilliantly kind,
h