Secondary sources in Zotero

LL8JJ

Hello I am a newbie to Zotero which I find excellent,

Does Zotero allow us to enter secondary sources now. I understand it was not possible before, but has this changed as yet? If so, how do I enter this information? I am using a mac.

If it is not possible, is there a work around? If so, please share.

Thanks

L

adamsmith

Do you mean by "secondary sources" one work as cited by another work*? If so, the answer is no. The best workaround is to put the work cited - i.e. the one which you don't have access to yourself - in a prefix of the citation. Since you haven't actually consulted that work, I would not include it in your bibliography.

*if so, that's not what people usually mean by secondary sources. A scholarly book about the US Civil War, e.g. is a secondary source, as opposed to the Diary of Gen. Sherman, which is a primary source.

LL8JJ

Thank you, Mr. Smith.

I did, indeed, mean a source I had not accessed myself, but which was referenced in the body of another piece of work.

What do you mean by a "prefix" of the citation?

Separately. How would I reference a chapter written in a report by different authors from those who published the report. I have access to the report and can see the chapter written. How would I enter the actual authors of the chapter into Zotero.

Thank you in advance.

adamsmith

What do you mean by a "prefix" of the citation?

http://www.zotero.org/support/word_processor_plugin_usage#prefix_and_suffix

How would I reference a chapter written in a report by different authors from those who published the report.

Zotero doesn't have report chapters, but Book Section should for all practical purposes work fine.

LL8JJ

Thank you on both counts.

The only problem with using Book Section for a Section in a Report is that in Zotero the document will be classified as a book when, in fact, it is a report. Not a major issue.

Regarding the first question, I am a little concerned that as the original source will not be included in my bibliography (as I did not read it myself), that simply including the name of the author and the year in the prefix of the citation in-text would not be enough for readers to find the original text easily. Of course, the original (and full details of the source document) will be seen in the bibliography of the document that I referred to (and included) in my bibliography -- it will just take a bit of digging around for people.

Is this feature going to be in any future updates to Zotero, do you think?

L

LL8JJ

If I manually edit a citation in Word (i.e. enter a work in a prefix of my citation) then at some point in the future refresh Zotero, will my manual edits remain in place or will they be erased?

adamsmith

I don't know if this will be added as a feature, it's a bit of a mess - FWIW, many purists would argue that works that you haven't consulted shouldn't be in your bibliography, but if you do want to, you can add items to the bibliography via the "Edit Bibliography" button.
Re your second question: If you use the prefix field of the Zotero Word plugin as per the link I posted, those changes will stick on refresh, including when you change citation styles. In most cases I'd recommend against editing directly in Word - those changes may get lost on refresh.

LL8JJ

If I download a pdf from a website, what is the fastest way to enter the details into Zotero?

So far, this is what I've been doing.
1. find the pdf online
2. download it and name and save it to my computer
3. go into Zotero and start a New report
4. find the pdf on my computer and drag it into Zotero
5. from within Zotero, right click and it and choose ""Create metadata from PDF"
and as happens often I get the message "No matching references found"
6. I then enter all the relevant information manually.

I just wonder if there is a quicker way to do this. If not, I will continue.

adamsmith

which browser are you using?

LL8JJ

Safari

adamsmith

I'm pretty sure you can drag the PDF right from Safari to Zotero by dragging and dropping the icon on the left of the URL (that's definitely the case for Chrome). So that collapses 2 and 4 into one step. You also don't need to do 3. You can either rely on retrieve metadata or when that doesn't work: right-click --> Create Parent Item

LL8JJ

I can't drag pdfs from Safari.

For example:http://www.oaklandinstitute.org/sites/oaklandinstitute.org/files/OI_country_report_tanzania.pdf
Although the pdf is on the page, the "Z" to the left of the address block for the web page address is greyed out so I can't click it.

I have to download the pdf from the page then go through the steps above.
Let me know if you can do something else.

adamsmith

are you sure? Click and drag the icon that's still in the URL bar, immediately to the left of the URL. On this page it's a lock, on other pages a globe, not sure what it shows for PDFs.

LL8JJ

No lock, I'm afraid. I have the letter "Z", but greyed out.

On this page I see

Immediately to the left of the URL is "+" which is the bookmark tab.
Then immediately to the left of that is a large "Z" but it is greyed out.

This is exactly what I see whenever I have a PdF.

aurimas

Or just select the whole url and drag that

adamsmith

what aurimas says - for the icon - I mean e.g. the grey apple logo here:
http://images.anandtech.com/reviews/mac/Tiger/SafariPDF.jpg

LL8JJ

Sorry, but nothing happens.

Where your screen shot shows

Forward then Back arrows Refresh "+" for bookmark then the grey Apple logo
followed by the URL,

mine shows

Forward then Back arrows "Z" for Zotero but greyed out "+" for bookmark then Apple logo followed by the URL.

I have dragged the entire url and brought it over Zotero (opened) but it goes nowhere - definitely not into Zotero. The system does not accept pdfs.

Just wondered if anyone has an idea which would be better than what I've been doing.

LL8JJ

Thank you all your help. I really appreciate it.

Regards
L