Zotero and EndNote compared: Lessons learned

techczech
I love Zotero and I hate EndNote. Nevertheless, I will have to keep using both for the foreseable future. Here's why and hoping it might be instructive.

Why I love Zotero:

* it's open source
* its name is based on an Albanian word (a language I happen to know a little)
* its integration with the online workflows of an academic (Firefox)


Why I hate EndNote:

* it is confusing with ugly layout and not enough shortcuts
* AdeptScientific release a full new version a year which should really be just a point version or often a free bug fix but they charge us for it
* it lacks basic common-sense features such as (really inexcusable in such an expensive product):
o inline editing (in an excel like interface)
o linking of items (e.g. linking a chapter entry to a book entry so that you don't have to retype all the details)
o limiting display of fields in edit window
o side by side preview


Why I can't switch (yet):

* Zotero get pretty slow when it's full of items - my current endnote library has almost 1600 items which when imported made Zotero slowed it to a crawl while EndNote handles them effortlessly
* I need to use rich text when taking notes
* I also use the connect feature of EndNote all the time; it would be nice to supplement the data collection feature with a remote connection
* EndNote's Word integration works much more seamlessly at the moment


What would make the switch easier:

* improved speed
* MOST IMPORTANT: full import from EndNote:
o I have lots of highlighting and other rich text in my research notes and would hate to loose them
o I have lots of PDFs and DOCs linked to my EndNote database - loosing those links would be too painful


What would make my life easier in the meantime:
One thing: One click publishing of items from Zotero to EndNote (or other reference managers) - similar to websites offering the same feature; I often just get one reference into Zotero and right now, it's sometimes easier for me to create a new EndNote entry manually than to go through the export/import process [I believe that was suggested elsewhere]

NOTE: This is not a feature request, just a use case submitted in the hope that an example "from the trenches" might prove useful.
  • bdarcus
    edited August 24, 2007
    * Zotero get pretty slow when it's full of items - my current endnote library has almost 1600 items which when imported made Zotero slowed it to a crawl while EndNote handles them effortlessly
    * I need to use rich text when taking notes
    Both of these will almost certainly be addressed ultimately (though I've repeatedly pleaded that Zotero do better than "rich text", which is sooo 1980s).
    * I also use the connect feature of EndNote all the time; it would be nice to supplement the data collection feature with a remote connection
    I consider this a really low priority.

    Zotero works differently than Endnote, which is a pre-web application. You can achieve the same effect by searching via web interface and importing the results from there.

    I am a former Endnote user, and I'd just like to plead with people to be open-minded about what Zotero is and what it can become. Simply copying Endnote would not be a good idea.
    I have lots of PDFs and DOCs linked to my EndNote database - loosing those links would be too painful
    Does Endnote export these links? If so, how?
  • techczech
    * I also use the connect feature of EndNote all the time; it would be nice to supplement the data collection feature with a remote connection

    I consider this a really low priority.
    I agree. It's mostly a change in perspective. I can just as easily go to the Library of Congress, do my search and have Zotero import it. Sometimes, that's a bit too much hassle, though.
    I have lots of PDFs and DOCs linked to my EndNote database - loosing those links would be too painful

    Does Endnote export these links? If so, how?
    Yes, although it does it differently from version X on when it (finally) started using its own folder and giving relative links to it. Previous versions use absolute paths which isn't that helpful.

    Here's an example of the exported format:
    L1 - internal-pdf://attached%20file.pdf
  • bdarcus
    Ugh; typical non-standard hack.

    So how do you know what the base directory is?
  • techczech
    So how do you know what the base directory is?
    That, luckily is standard. Each .enl file has an directory associated with it ending in .Data. The files are in a subdirectory called PDF.Each file is in its own folder with the same name ending in a unique number but that is part of the exported path.
  • pcav
    I also need some text formatting: in biological paper, the scientific name has to be italic. I did not find a way to do that; even autoimport from web sites do not work (see e.g. http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1466-8238.2007.00347.x )
  • techczech
    That's a good point. Not something that comes up often for me but EndNote does allow for that. Ultimately, you'd have to fix that in the final document and place some sort of tags there for the moment to remind you.
  • bdarcus
    I also need some text formatting: in biological paper, the scientific name has to be italic.
    Unless you happening to be using a style that italicizes the title.

    See here and here. I hope Zotero will do better on this issue than Endnote.
  • raf
    Both of these will almost certainly be addressed ultimately (though I've repeatedly pleaded that Zotero do better than "rich text", which is sooo 1980s).
    Some wiki-style editing of notes would be really cool.
  • jimdelaney
    I for one much prefer the plain text editing. It's fast and simple, and much better for cutting and pasting quotes, etc. I get all of the structure that I need from using multiple notes, tags and links. I do like the idea of more Wiki-style links though...
  • chrisalbon
    I would be happy as long as we could turn on / off rich text editing.

    Ideally the notes would be web-compatible so that in the future they can be integrated with some online service.
  • mbluth
    I use Zotero and Endnote, but when I try to import citations from the Ebsco MLA database and put them into Endnote, Zotero captures them instead. This renders the items useless, since all Zotero captures is a link instead of the citation.

    How can Zotero be turned off?

    Thanks.
  • sybille
    There's an option to turn off automatic importing of RIS/Refer files in the Zotero "Preferences..." which can be found in the "Actions" menu (the button with the gear icon).
  • mbluth
    Thanks, sybille!
  • marsh
    On 24-Aug Bohemicus wrote (if one of you geniuses out there can explain how to quote postings on this board, I'd appreciate it):

    -----
    I agree. It's mostly a change in perspective. I can just as easily go to the Library of Congress, do my search and have Zotero import it. Sometimes, that's a bit too much hassle, though.
    ---------

    Could you please give a bit more detail. I find the Melvyl database (which has records for the holdings of all 10 Univ. of Calif. and 40 Calif. State Colleges = 50 academic libraries) is better than the L of C. I use EndNote's connect feature and do not even have to know the URL for a web-based search (I don't even know if there is one, although the students and faculty without EN must use something.) EN has a list of several hundred libraries to which it connects. With Zotero, we need to know the URL of a library's search page, no? Also, with EN, I can easily select which items to import. For example, I can search Melvyl for books by "Alfred Chandler" and get a list of 80 items; then I can choose the ones I want and import them into EN almost effortlessly. I haven't tried doing the same in Zotero. Is it as easy?
  • noksagt
    edited September 4, 2007
    how to quote postings on this board
    Enclose the quote in HTML tags <blockquote>like this</blockquote>
    I use EndNote's connect feature and do not even have to know the URL for a web-based search (I don't even know if there is one, although the students and faculty without EN must use something.)
    http://melvyl.cdlib.org/
    With Zotero, we need to know the URL of a library's search page, no?
    As with EndNote, there is a list of URLs, so no--there does not seem to be much more to remember. Since Zotero requires a web browser, keeping a set of bookmarks for the particular resources you use seems prudent. However, this is a good enough reason to keep that list current & comprehensive.
    For example, I can search Melvyl for books by "Alfred Chandler" and get a list of 80 items; then I can choose the ones I want and import them into EN almost effortlessly. I haven't tried doing the same in Zotero. Is it as easy?
    Yes. A similar search through the above URL also returns 80 results, divided by 20 per page. Clicking the Zotero icon will list the titles of the 20 results on the current page & let you pick and choose what to import.

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