Odd use of author first name initials in citations in Harvard styles

Cooper42

I'm getting odd appearances of author first name initials in the Harvard reference styles I'm using.

I've tried with the default Harvard, and the Open Univeristy and Annals of the Ass. of American Geographer style (which are both close enough to what i need for now) and all tend to add first name initials in odd locations.

For example, the first two references of what I'm currently writing appear as:
(Dorrian & G. Rose 2003)
(M. Rose & Wylie 2006)

For some reason it's adding first name initials on a seemingly random basis. I've got around this before by manually editing citations, but would like to just be able to sort it out once and for all.

In both those articles in the Zotero library, and throughout my library I have all authors first name in full and surname in full, saved in <surname>, <first name> form, and so I have no idea why it is adding initials in odd places - there seems no rhyme or reason.

noksagt

It is not random. See http://www.zotero.org/support/kb/given_name_disambiguation

Cooper42

Ok, thanks. I can see the use of the same surname in the example above, I guess I didn't see the disambiguation on my other work as I guess I didn't realise there were a number of uses of the same surname.

Never seen that done in citations before. Is this something more common to science journals?

adamsmith

this is very common in author-date styles in many disciplines (certainly in the social sciences) including the most common relatively generic ones - Chicago's author date style and the APA style and if I recall correctly MLA.

Edit: in some cases the rules are more sophisticated and Zotero can't do that - so while Zotero disambiguates all authors with same last name, some styles would only do that when there could indeed be confusion - i.e. if there are two Rose 1999 you don't want the as Rose 1999a and Rose 1999b if really they are G. Rose 1999 and B. Rose 1999), but not in your case where the two citations are clearly identifiable.

ubus

I get this without any name ambiguity. There is only one author named Read in my database and only one publication from her, but persistently she is cited as D.Read.
When I check the entry in the style browser, citation is correct, only in OOo Writer is the initial added. I had this couple of times with other authors before, where there might have been an ambiguity (wasn't aware of the rule than), but here I am dead sure there's no ambiguity at all.
Any other ideas?

adamsmith

there is no other possibility why Zotero would do that. It's disambiguation with 100% certainty.
There are a number of ways this could happen - there could be another Read somewhere hidden as the 15th author of an et al. article. There could be a Read&Read article etc.
You could have the same item twice in your database, with different author spellings.

But it's definitely some form of disambiguation.

ubus

Thanks for the speedy response!
Touche, there is a 6th author, Read, S. in another publication - but it doesn't make sense to differentiate here, as the quote wouldn't be identified with Read in the slightest (as it is given as Gray et al). But probably that's where the style guides are to blame and not Zotero.
It is odd though, that when I hightlight the source and go to chrome://zotero/content/tools/csledit.xul, everything looks peachy - no initial. Shouldn't the same rule apply there as well?

Wouldn't a rule, only disambiguating if actually cited author names are identical make more sense? In the bibliography, it remained clear who's who, so transparency was maintained. Any idea what changes in the csl code this would require?

adamsmith

there is a new csl processor which has much more sophisticated disambiguation capabilities - it is currently being integrated with Zotero and will role out soonish. It will allow this behavior to be fixed. Right now there's nothing you can do - best to edit this at the end.

I don't know what's up with the test pane - did you try highlighting both citations?

ubus

Thanks again! Yes, when both are highlighted, the second Read is initialled in the test pane as well. I will wait patiently for the new csl processor!
I really appreciate your work - it's a great help with domesticating academic referencing, particularly when writing in several locations!

timolsen

Any way to turn this functionality off? i.e. so it does not try to disambiguate?

adamsmith

take out the line
<option name="disambiguate-add-givenname" value="true"/>
from the style.
See here for a generic how to on simple modifications:
http://www.zotero.org/support/csl_simple_edits

timolsen

adamsmith is simply brilliant!

Anska

Dear Adam (or anyone else who understands this problem), I hope you can help. The link you have above is broken and I have the same problem described by the lovely people up above. I'd like to 'disambiguate' too but I'm a computer noob and need a helping hand. I hope you can help.

Thank you.

DWL-SDCA

Try this:

http://www.zotero.org/support/dev/citation_styles/style_editing_step-by-step

I'm not sure that it is what @adamsmith was pointing to but I think you will find it helpful.

Anska

Thanks very much. I've clicked on the link which seems great and completed step 1.

1 - I have updated the APA 6th edition style from the Zotero Style Repository.
"Update existing style "American Psychological Association 6th Edition" with "American Psychological Association 6th Edition" from http://www.zotero.org/styles/apa? Confirm Install?" Which I've done and that is good.

My problem starts with the next step.

2 - How do I download the style onto my computer please? Every time I click on the style in the Zot Style Repos - it just asks the above question "Update existing....etc" again.

Thanks for help.

Gracile

Right click (mac: ctrl+click), "Save target as"

Anska

Many thanks DWL and Gracile - seems to be working great now.