Timline on Mac Word 2004 plugin?

greggor.mattson

When I downloaded Beta I somehow missed the warning that it wasn't compatible with Mac Word 2004. Any idea when this plugin will become available? Or do I have to try to reconstruct my library using Time Machine...

Thanks for any guesstimate.

ahoward

If it's any easier than using Time Machine, you could export your library to RDF. That would be reverse compatible to 1.0.x. You could also try using OpenOffice and the associated plugin, if you can't upgrade to Word 2008. There is some talk of developing a Word 2004 plugin that's compatible, but nothing definite.

NoisyNarrowBand

the compatibility grid says the plugin for word 2004 is coming soon! I hope that is still true?! I am eagerly waiting for it as this keeps me from updating to 1.5 beta.

without the menu-bar I find the word 2008 integration cumbersome. I know about the technical reasons and its a pity that there is no easy fix for this.

dstillman

Using Time Machine to downgrade would be preferable, since with RDF you'd lose the links to citations in existing documents (and possibly run into some other issues). You can (back up and) replace the entire 'zotero' directory in your Firefox profile with the latest version from Time Machine. See http://www.zotero.org/support/zotero_data for an overview.

We're still hoping to provide a Word 2004–compatible plugin that works with 1.5, but there's no ETA.

without the menu-bar I find the word 2008 integration cumbersome

You probably know this, but you can use keyboard shortcuts (w/Control-Option) to run the menu commands.

NoisyNarrowBand

dan,
thx for your quick reply. yes I do know about the short-cuts but I already use tons of em and I guess my brain is at the end of its capacity to remember shortcuts ;)

that said I also don't think that word 2008 is a good product. its not bad but I rather stick with 2004 for the time being.

'still hoping' does not sound very encouraging. is there a commitment by the zotero dev's to support 2004 for 1.5 and beyond?!

sean

We plan to support it, but it's not a high priority issue for two related reasons:

1) We prioritize development to support current and upcoming software. Word 2004 is 5 years old. I'm not wild about Word 2008 either, and I don't see it as a clear improvement over Word 2004. But then again, I was perfectly happy with Word 5.1.

2) There is significant overhead associated with supporting Microsoft Office's various flavors and platforms. Dropping VBA in Office 2008 was a knuckleheaded move that made life extremely difficult for third-party developers. The steps we took to work around this change ultimately have made for a much speedier and more efficient plugin, but the downside is the loss of Word 2004 compatibility.

NoisyNarrowBand

sean,
thx for taking time to adress this question. I am glad to hear that you plan to support 04 and hope for a timely release.

I am aware of the vba-issues and regard it as ms powerplay and a deliberate move to depreciate the osx platform. maybe after finishing my current project I should ditch office altogether and finally migrate to oo - 3.1. is shaping up nicely...

hgray

I'd also like the plug-in. I would just assume stick with 04 because I don't like the look and feel (or poor design) of 08.

Simon

I just finished up a plug-in for Word 2004, and it's now in our SVN repository. Please allow a few days for a public release.

NoisyNarrowBand

most awesome simon! thx so much!

NoisyNarrowBand

any news on estimated availability of the word 2004 plug-in?!

thx!

sean

We're testing it now, but it should be available very soon. It's compatible with OS X 10.4 and higher.

Simon

You can try out the SVN (experimental) version of the Word 2004 plug-in now by downloading it from here. Since it hasn't been extensively tested, you should backup your Word files regularly, although if there is any data loss, it can probably be reversed via the Word "Undo" function. Please post any issues you encounter on the forums and we'll try to sort them out.

sean

And please note that the above-linked Word plugin is for use only with Zotero 1.5 and above.

NoisyNarrowBand

simon & sean,
thx so far. gave the plug-in a try but revoked back to 1.09 after a few hours. it worked fine, but needed a couple of refresh every now and then as zotero would tell me firefox is not running. I am in the middle of a book and decided to stick with with older version for another couple of weeks. will give it another spin then!

cabarne17

Hi,

Please please please keep working on that Mac 2004 integration. I downloaded the experimental version, but I am trying to finish my dissertation in the next couple of months and need this to work right.

I must say that the warnings for the installation of Zotero 1.5 need to be way way way way way way way way way more pronounced. The fact that you cannot revert back to the older version may have nothing to do with you, but I never in a million years would have installed it had I seen the warnings that you cannot revert. That should be on the front page in huge red font right under the download the veta version link. I didn't have OS X 10.5 and I was using Office 2004. I bought the new operating system and now I'm going to have to buy the new office software just to make this work again.

I'm thinking of just switching to something else, but I really liked using Zotero until this not-sufficient-warning thing happened. I think that the product is really cool, but I am really really frustrated.

noksagt

It is unfortunate that you are experiencing problems.

I must say that the warnings for the installation of Zotero 1.5 need to be way way way way way way way way way more pronounced.

Any additional suggestions for where to do this? The warnings are in the documentation for 1.5 and the installation informs you that your database must be upgraded to work with 1.5. I don't know if another warning on the first page would be very helpful. In what ways does 1.5 not work for you?

I didn't have OS X 10.5

Did you have 10.4?

cabarne17

yes. I had 10.4. I don't think all that many people always read all of the documentation for updates of software that they are using. Maybe that's just me, but I read the features and the first part of the page and called it good. Your warnings aren't until the middle of the page and are still not excessively prominent like they should be. You should put the warnings on the main page right under the link to download the new version.

I still can't get 1.5 to work because I don't have Office 2008 and I can't get the experimental Word 2004 plugin to work yet. I got Zotero to work again in Firefox once I updated to 10.5, but it won't integrate with Word still. I'm still working on it, though.

Maybe the warning could be on the mainpage something like this:

Link (Download 1.5 beta)
Warning: Must have Office 2008 and OS X 10.5

noksagt

I can't get the experimental Word 2004 plugin to work yet.

What issues are you having? I don't usually use Zotero in OS X on my powerbook. When I do, it has been with the Word 2004 plugin, though.

I got Zotero to work again in Firefox once I updated to 10.5,

I would have thought that it should work in 10.4 (as Firefox 3 works in 10.4). What issues did you have?

sean

Zotero works fine in OS X 10.4. I'm using it right now. I also have not experienced any problems with the Word 2004 plugin.

cabarne17

the problems are related to the Zotero 1.5 beta version, not the older version. The older version did work fine and then I updated to the beta version and the beta version doesn't work with Word 2004 or OS X 10.4. It works with Word 2008 and OS X 10.5 only right now.
There is a very new version of the Word plugin for the 1.5 beta. I haven't been able to get that to work. That is the problem I am having. Zotero 1.5 beta was also not working until I updated to OS X 10.5. Now it works fine within Firefox 3, but won't integrate with Word 2004.

sean

It works with Word 2008 and OS X 10.5 only right now.

This is a false statement.

I should have been more clear: Zotero 1.5 works fine in OS X 10.4. I'm using it right now.

If you are having problems with the Word 2004 plugin, please let us know what they are so that we can help you.

Simon

Would you mind telling us your computer model, or alternatively, your processor architecture? I've personally tested the plug-in on 10.4 Intel, but not PPC.

cabarne17

I have a PPC powerbook. 1.67 GHz processor and 1.5 GB RAM. I am no longer using OS X 10.4. I updated to 10.5, but I still have Office 2004. I finally worked out getting the Zotero plugin to work (sort of) for Word 2004. It doesn't seem to be working correctly though. When I insert a citation, it works fine, but then when I go to insert a second citation it asks me if I want to "Replace this Zotero field?" (even if the previous citation is not highlighted) and I can only replace the previous citation. This also happens when I try to insert a bibliography.

In an effort to not just be a complainer, I will say that the whole process so far seems to be working much faster than it used to with the older version. I'm pretty hopeful about getting it to work. I like the software.

sean

I'm not seeing anything like this. I've got Word 2004 working fine with Zotero 1.5 beta on both 10.4 (PPC) and 10.5 (Intel). What style are you using? Could you provide exact steps to reproduce the problem?

molland

I have a similar problem to cabarnet17. I use 10.4 (PPC), Zotero 1.5 beta but cannot get the word 2004 plugin to work. I have tried the 1.0b3 plugin but it is incompatible with 1.5 beta. Then I have tried to upgrade by downloading the beta plugin (from Simon's post above). When I then open word I cannot find the zotero toolbar. I sort of fixed this by locating the zotero.dot file through the templates and add-ins menu in word (I located it in office/startup/word). This brings up the zotero toolbar, but then I get exactly the same problem as cabarnet17. Second time I try to insert a citation it gives me the option of either "replace this zotero field" or cancel.

molland

I forgot to add that I have tried with different bibliographic styles, but the problem remains.

sean

Which styles did you try?

molland

Thank you for responding so quickly Simon.

I have tried Harvard (Reference format: Author, date). This is the style I use. In addition I have also tried Journal of Royal Anthropology Institute and Chicago manual style (Author date). None of them work. I have also tried to switch between fields and bookmarks. The latter does now work at all.

Another thing. When I reopen word, I still need to manually activate the zotero toolbar by through "templates and add-ins under the tools menu.

molland

Sorry, not Simon -, I mean Sean. I looked at the wrong post.

Simon

molland, I can now confirm that author-date styles are producing these issues. A temporary workaround, albeit a poor one, is to use Chicago footnote style, then switch to an author-date style when you are ready to print your document. If things go well, however, I hope to fix this by the end of the day.